Climate Change

[Atilla]

If you take a container of air and another container with added CO2 , you expose them to sunlight the one with CO2 gets hotter, significantly.
This is not statistics and neither an opinion it is scientifical evidence.
There is not need for "support", it is the reality, you can like it or not, if I dont' like that the grass is green the grass is still green.
There are many forms of pollution, CO2 pollution has become an emergency and what is an emergency becomes mainstream, and being mainstrem daos not mean it becomes fake or a manipulation from "the world order" vs the the average Joe.

Agreed but what readings would you get if instead of CO2 you filled the container with any other particle?

As the suns rays hit the particles wouldn't they all get hot?

If there are more cities and road surfaces there surely is more material to warm up the air around them, thus global warming as a consequence of man made stuff.

So not denying what you say, simply that after so much BS and bad science backed by big G I'm a little more cautious

 

[CavaliereVerde]

Agreed but what readings would you get if instead of CO2 you filled the container with any other particle?

CH4 is even worse and there are other gases that causes warming.
If you know the basics af physiscs and chemistry global warming is easy to understand, not rocket science.
I can explain you the chemistry but I am not a climatoligist but according to my sgnificant knowledge of light and chemistry it makes perfect sense.
A certain amount of skepticism is healthy but too much skepticism becomes denial.
If US EU and China tell me global warming is an emergency, it is an emergency.

 

[CavaliereVerde]

Agreed but what readings would you get if instead of CO2 you filled the container with any other particle?

As the suns rays hit the particles wouldn't they all get hot?

Greenhouse effect - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

The introduction answers your question.

 

[Atilla]

CH4 is even worse and there are other gases that causes warming.
If you know the basics af physiscs and chemistry global warming is easy to understand, not rocket science.
I can explain you the chemistry but I am not a climatoligist but according to my sgnificant knowledge of light and chemistry it makes perfect sense.
A certain amount os skepticism is healthy but too much skepticism becomes denial.
If US EU and China tell me global warming is an emergency, it is an emergency.

I have A-Level Physics and remember Charles law on gasses and how compression heats the molecules up but that's about it from me. I am inclined to believe the science yes, but my point was that temperature variances have occurred before. This time round it seems like the pace of change is an issue.

On another level, I'm always shocked when I hear people having 4-12 children. Whilst there are big variations in birth rates I do think people should show more restraint rather than just simply breed like animals but each to their own I guess.

From another perspective, some say there is no such is wrong weather, just wrong preparation or type of clothes. So we could simply create alternative habitats and embrace the change making use of the warming up. Think outside of the box, dig for opportunities maybe under water (City of Atlantis) or in caves. A brave new world might emerge.

 

[CavaliereVerde]

I am inclined to believe the science yes,

We have only science, the alternative is religion.
You can believe the Bible : earth is flat and the sun is moving around it.
There is another religion, the religion of denial/conspiracy.
Everything "they" tell us is fake, to fool us and manipulate us.
Is Greta fake? Maybe, I dont' know but I don't care.
Elon Musk is not fake.
Bill Gates is not fake.

 

[CavaliereVerde]

You can believe the Bible

Maybe also the Bible is right...
Drought, famine, plague, war, the apocalypse knights...

 

[timsk]

We have only science, the alternative is religion.
You can believe the Bible : earth is flat and the sun is moving around it.
There is another religion, the religion of denial/conspiracy.
Everything "they" tell us is fake, to fool us and manipulate us.
Is Greta fake? Maybe, I dont' know but I don't care.
Elon Musk is not fake.
Bill Gates is not fake.

CV,
You keep referring to 'science' as if there is any real science to back up your theory of climate change. There's precious little - if any at all. Just repeating the same old mantras that scientists say it's a fact doesn't make it so. You're vision is so blinkered that you refuse to even consider an alternative narrative. Unless and until that changes, there's little point in me continuing to engage with you on this. If you want to have a sensible discussion, a good place to start would be to explain why the last article I posted is wrong and provide evidence to support your claim. I suspect you know you can't, so the only option available to you is to not read it in the first place. Your mind appears completely closed on the issue - which ought to be the biggest of red flags for any 'real' scientist.
Tim.

 

[CavaliereVerde]

provide evidence to support your claim

 

[timsk]

While about covid the problem was govs facing the unknown.

CV,
In the first few months, yes. Thereafter, they knew exactly what they were dealing with and milked the pandemic for all it was worth - and still are. It'll be interesting to see how many people get the new covid booster jab this autumn, given how all the jabs thus far have been so spectacularly unsuccessful - except at causing long term damage to health and, in some cases, death.

We know everything about climate change, there is plenty of evidence in experiments and data and everyone can see the disasters happening in front of our eyes.

Most of what scientists tell us about climate change is based on modelling. If the pandemic taught us anything, it's that computer models are worse than useless. As for 'disasters', you're referring, for example, to forest fires which, bizarrely, start next to roads. How could that be?! Or perhaps floods? Well, if you cover flood plains in tarmac and houses, then the water finds somewhere else to go. As you say, it's not rocket science.

At this point the emergency is a fact and the different opinion is denial, it is science not politics, 2+2=4 it is not an opinion.
It is not like Trump vs Biden, leave vs remain, private health vs public health.

Well, it would be if the climate zealots could produce real science to support your claims. They can't. Like I say, computer models are worse than useless.

What could be discussed is how to deal with the emergency, how to prioritize electrification, transit, nuclear energy or renewables.

The only emergency is that climate extremists are in power everywhere and are hell bent on taking everyone down a path that will be a disaster for millions, billions even, and cost many lives. All the while, the globalist elites (e.g. Deloitte in the Jordan Peterson vid') rake in massive profits. It's about power, control and money; taking as much of it as possible from the ordinary wo/man in the street and putting into the hands of those who already have too much of it and use it to abuse us. Anyone with an open mind willing to consider alternative views will be able to see all this very clearly.
Tim.

 

[CavaliereVerde]

The only emergency is that climate extremists are in power everywhere

From what I see in rivers, lakes and my garden I need them to be even more extreme.

 

[timsk]

From what I see in rivers, lakes and my garden I need them to be even more extreme.

I've no idea what you keep in your garden CV, but if you're referring to pollution in lakes and rivers - that's got absolutely nothing to do with climate change. Perhaps, you're referring to the warm spell and water levels are low in lakes and rivers? Well, the same applies, that also has nothing to do with climate change. Every so often we have an especially hot and dry summer and the water levels drop. No big deal, nothing unusual about that, nothing to see here. It's just climate doomsday alarmists taking any and every opportunity to create fear unnecessarily in order to con the gullible into their death cult.
Tim.

 

[CavaliereVerde]

I've no idea what you keep in your garden CV,

Grass, and it is yellow.

if you're referring to pollution in lakes and rivers - that's got absolutely nothing to do with climate change.

I ma referring to very low level, never seen Como lake so low, the same for Po river and other lakes and rivers this summer.
Mountains are without ice.
You don't need to be a scientist, you dont' need to listen to BBC or Obama, just use your eyes, memory and common sense.

 

[Atilla]

Grass, and it is yellow.

I ma referring to very low level, never seen Como lake so low, the same for Po river and other lakes and rivers this summer.
Mountains are without ice.
You don't need to be a scientist, you dont' need to listen to BBC or Obama, just use your eyes, memory and common sense.

Yep I can vouch for that in my 60 years I've never seen anything like it.

 

[CavaliereVerde]

Hot summers happen but in the last 10 year we are having one of them every 3 years.
This year we had : hot and dry winter, dry spring, hot and dry summer.
Not usual noise.

 

[CavaliereVerde]

 

[timsk]

You don't need to be a scientist, you dont' need to listen to BBC or Obama, just use your eyes, memory and common sense.

My common sense tells me you're adding 2+2=5.
If there's a slight increase in global temperatures, then it's entirely logical that this will be reflected in what we're all experiencing. However, temperatures would have to rise another 2 degrees to get into the realms of anything outside of historical extremes. And, when that last happened, there were hippopotamus' living along the Thames and the yellow grass of your lawn was, in all probability, a lovely Italian burnt sienna colour! So CV, there's no need to worry, there's really nothing out of the ordinary going on. And even if there is, there's no evidence to support these crazy theories about CO2 emissions being the cause.
Tim.

 

[CavaliereVerde]

I ma not a fan of alarmism and catastrophims but the point is that without alarms amd emergencies there is total lack of action.
People, politicians and businessmen work their ass only if ther is an emergency.
Yes they do something for environment, something like 5% of what should be done.
Better to hope for the best but be prepared for the worst.
Maybe you are right and I am wrong, mainstream science is wrong, Bill Gates is wrong and Elon Musk is wrong.

 

[Atilla]

My common sense tells me you're adding 2+2=5.
If there's a slight increase in global temperatures, then it's entirely logical that this will be reflected in what we're all experiencing. However, temperatures would have to rise another 2 degrees to get into the realms of anything outside of historical extremes. And, when that last happened, there were hippopotamus' living along the Thames and the yellow grass of your lawn was, in all probability, a lovely Italian burnt sienna colour! So CV, there's no need to worry, there's really nothing out of the ordinary going on. And even if there is, there's no evidence to support these crazy theories about CO2 emissions being the cause.
Tim.

Hi Tim,

You say 2 degrees but this summer I experienced 42.5C for the first time in my life. Last highest was once 40C in the US. But in the UK, I don't recall ever getting above 35C. That was just once too. So I think the global warming is defo occurring at a much faster rate than ever before.

Appreciate the averages and all that but what we are having is also extreme weather. India went over 50 and Canada -40.

Then there is flash rainfall like months worth in an hour and so forth.

So maybe we are approaching another Noah moment?

How about rivers with dead fish appearing all over the place? Are they dying because it's too hot?

Oder river: mystery of mass die-off of fish lingers as no toxic substances found

Polish scientists only found elevated salt levels after thousands of dead fish were found floating in the central European waterway

www.theguardian.com

I'm wondering with some curiosity what I will experience in the last 20 years of my life having witnessed the previous decade.

 

[timsk]

You say 2 degrees but this summer I experienced 42.5C for the first time in my life. Last highest was once 40C in the US. But in the UK, I don't recall ever getting above 35C. That was just once too. So I think the global warming is defo occurring at a much faster rate than ever before.

Hi At',
Yes, I'm talking about the long term - very long term! - statistical averages. Climate alarmists say that the earth's temperature has risen one degree in the last 150 years ago - coinciding with the industrial revolution and all that's happened since. They are correct. What they don't tell you is that the temp' 150 years ago was at a historical low point and that temps have been 2 degrees hotter than they are now which, self evidently, can not be accounted for by wo/man made climate change. My point, therefore, is that even if the climate alarmists are right, we've still got a long way to go before we hit previous highs and, what's more, it'll take a long time to get there. So, if it's a problem, we've got decades upon decades to find a solution. All this talk of the oceans rising up and millions dying due to flooding and the earth burning due to forest fires etc, is patently obviously complete tosh. Sorry Greta - but you're bonkers!

Appreciate the averages and all that but what we are having is also extreme weather. India went over 50 and Canada -40.
Then there is flash rainfall like months worth in an hour and so forth.
So maybe we are approaching another Noah moment?

The reasons why we're having more extreme weather has everything to do with the activity of the sun and little or nothing to do with CO2 emissions which only make up a small percentage of greenhouse gases. (Circa 3% if I remember rightly?) And of that, termites produce more CO2 than wo/mankind does by burning fossil fuels!!!

How about rivers with dead fish appearing all over the place? Are they dying because it's too hot?

Oder river: mystery of mass die-off of fish lingers as no toxic substances found

Polish scientists only found elevated salt levels after thousands of dead fish were found floating in the central European waterway

www.theguardian.com

I've not heard about that and can't account for it. That said, the most likely explanation is provided in the article itself:
". . . Both the German and Polish governments have said they assume the die-off was caused by toxic chemical spillage from industrial production, and Poland has offered a reward of 1m złoty or €210,000 (£180,000) for anyone who can “help find those responsible for this environmental disaster”. . ." I'll happily bet you a 1oz 999 silver Britannia that it's got bu88er all to do with climate change! ;-)

I'm wondering with some curiosity what I will experience in the last 20 years of my life having witnessed the previous decade.

Just to be crystal clear. I believe . . .
1. The earth's temperature changes continuously and likely will, at some point, get a fair bit hotter (and colder) than it is now.
2. Burning fossil fuels causes pollution which is harmful - especially to human health. (My late mother, a homeopath back in the days when no one knew what that was, told me as a young boy on a visit to London in the 60s that one day scientists would link exhaust emissions to lung disease and cancer.) Additionally, fossil fuels (mainly oil) is used to make numerous products which cause pollution that is harmful to all living things and to the planet. More - much more - needs to be done to tackle pollution of all kinds.
3. Fossil fuels won't last forever and the sooner we can replace them with something that's as good, sustainable, less polluting and, hopefully, cheaper - then so much the better. What's not to like!
4. The three points above are completely separate and distinct from the core message of the climate alarmists which I do not subscribe to at all. Their hysteria is based on pseudo science and fuelled by a political agenda to make the poor poorer and to maintain maximum control and leverage over the masses. It has absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with saving the planet.
Tim.

 

[timsk]

1,200 Scientists and Professionals Declare: “There is No Climate Emergency”​

"The political fiction that humans cause most or all climate change and the claim that the science behind this notion is ‘settled’, has been dealt a savage blow by the publication of a ‘World Climate Declaration (WCD)’ signed by over 1,100 scientists and professionals. There is no climate emergency, say the authors, who are drawn from across the world and led by the Norwegian physics Nobel Prize laureate Professor Ivar Giaever. Climate science is said to have degenerated into a discussion based on beliefs, not on sound self-critical science."

Roll up, roll up and place your bets please ladies 'n gents: will this declaration even get so much as a passing mention by MSM? Pigs can fly!